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X-Men #21

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Blackcyclops
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X-Men #21

Post by Blackcyclops » 09 Jun 2021, 10:55

I hate not recognizing who all the guest are!!!! It’s frustrating lol

Like who was the woman who talked to The Human Torch? Who did Cyclops give his speech to? Ugh!


Anyway, I loved this issue just because of the way it featured that speech from Cyclops that perfectly encapsulates how I’ve viewed the character from the first time I read him until now. It was all the things I love about him and frustrate me…this definitely won’t be for everyone but that speech? Loved it.

Also, Namor was being his best Hickman Namor self and also loved it.
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hotknives
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by hotknives » 09 Jun 2021, 11:51

I think Cyke was talking to Kevin Fiege about 'telling his story' - which is a level of meta I wasn't quite prepared for...!
This was fun though - intrigued to see what the big reveal is
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Gremlin
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by Gremlin » 09 Jun 2021, 12:00

Well Quentin went to all the Omegas and talked to them. Then we saw a planet high in the night sky. Are mutants about to colonise Mars?
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by Flapflop » 09 Jun 2021, 12:07

Gremlin wrote:
09 Jun 2021, 12:00
Well Quentin went to all the Omegas and talked to them. Then we saw a planet high in the night sky. Are mutants about to colonise Mars?
Or maybe to help Earth in being overpopulated they make Mars inhabitable again and also humans will be welcome there, next to mutants ofcourse. They will make a special gate for that, also usable by humans, so travelling to there will be easy.

Or a new planet all together, but revitalizing Mars would be most likely now, looked like the red planet already. And wasn't Mars colonized in one of Moira's past lives? Also House of X started with planting a flower on Mars.

That speech of Cyclops to Kevin Feige was brilliant, also as a nod to X-men still not in the MCU but will be sooner or later, and sums up Cyclops whole history and relationship to Xavier wonderful 8-)
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Usernamenotimportant
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by Usernamenotimportant » 09 Jun 2021, 18:05

George RR Martin should stop wasting his time in Galas and finish the damn book.

More Sinister secrets!

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Quick and Dead
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by Quick and Dead » 09 Jun 2021, 18:42

Blackcyclops wrote:
09 Jun 2021, 10:55
I hate not recognizing who all the guest are!!!! It’s frustrating lol

Like who was the woman who talked to The Human Torch? Who did Cyclops give his speech to? Ugh!
Sersi of the Eternals and Kevin Feige.

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Blackcyclops
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by Blackcyclops » 09 Jun 2021, 19:28

Quick and Dead wrote:
09 Jun 2021, 18:42
Blackcyclops wrote:
09 Jun 2021, 10:55
I hate not recognizing who all the guest are!!!! It’s frustrating lol

Like who was the woman who talked to The Human Torch? Who did Cyclops give his speech to? Ugh!
Sersi of the Eternals and Kevin Feige.
See I thought it was Sersi but I wasn’t 100% sure. I think they drew her to more closely resemble the actress.
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manuel_mc89
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by manuel_mc89 » 09 Jun 2021, 21:07

My only gripe is that Jean should have asked for Sage's help with the counting of the votes, given that apparently every single mutant on Earth was asked to volunteer and/or to vote, and even if Jean is an Omega telepath, how did she "compute" all of those voices and votes.

I really liked this issue.
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by Oldmanlogan79 » 09 Jun 2021, 22:46

I really loved the art in this issue. First couple of pages with Magneto, Xavier and Namor were great, I love Nick Dragotta view, Id love to see him around the x titles for real. Dautterman great as usual. And Werneck, man, that was class, what a Rogue he draws!! Amazing.
My favorite Gala issue at the moment. Very excited with the last scene.
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by EphemeristX » 09 Jun 2021, 22:57

manuel_mc89 wrote:
09 Jun 2021, 21:07
My only gripe is that Jean should have asked for Sage's help with the counting of the votes, given that apparently every single mutant on Earth was asked to volunteer and/or to vote, and even if Jean is an Omega telepath, how did she "compute" all of those voices and votes.

I really liked this issue.
I think it was less a vote count and more of a vote by applause situation. She'd feel greater pull behind various candidates and narrow it down between them.
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by tokenBG1009 » 09 Jun 2021, 23:31

So some of the Sinister Secrets are pretty obvious to me and others go over my head.
Spoiler: show
51. Xavier? He's the only one wearing any sort of mask.
52. Emma Frost (possibly Mystique who ordered the diamonds posing as Emma)
53. TMFKA, obviously
54. Jean Grey, the great Seducer?
55. No idea
56. No idea
57. Betsy and Kwannon
58. Dunno, but obviously something to do with Mad Jim
59. Dunno
SSR: Mystique and Inferno, obviously
60. Thanks for spoiling it Nathaniel.
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das_boot
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by das_boot » 10 Jun 2021, 08:43

Other than the Cyclops and Namor moment? Weakest issue of the week to me.

You really REALLY mean to tell me that in a telepathic “vote” or whatever the hell, Synch and Sunfire both put forward a more compelling argument for why they should be X-Men than 90% of the former team members? Nope. Not buying that for a second.

Again, it’s a Hickman issue, so it’s full of good ideas, it’s just a shame he doesn’t have the ability to consistently give a title heart to go with his clever ideas. The Cyclops stuff was great, as I mentioned previously, but it’s one of the rare examples of good character work in this title since it began.

The art was absolutely stunning though.

I’m quite bored of this event now. The whole “same night from different angles” thing is already wearing thin after five issues of it.
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Gremlin
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by Gremlin » 10 Jun 2021, 09:41

I would have actually liked to know the characters’ arguments. Sunfire has historically been hostile and dismissive of the X-Men team, so to not only join but to plead a case to join is a bit odd for him.

I disagree though that the event is wearing thin, for me anyway. I am actually relieved it’s not a single story but a scenario that the titles can use to propel their own stories forward. I will admit it’s a little scattershot as the actually Hellfire Gala itself is somewhat chaotic in that we are jumping backwards and forwards during it and only seeing snippets here and there. I’m loving the politics coming into play too, with the human sides in various titles ramping up their plans.
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by elixir86 » 10 Jun 2021, 10:28

I liked the scene with Namor, he being like - come back when you have more than an island to offer, and now soon they'll get a new planet.

Sinister Secret 54 is about
Spoiler: show
Cypher and Warlock
55 - Concils that are circling the sun?
Spoiler: show
Quite Council, Great Ring of Arrako, Orchis, Illuminati? Akkaba? Avengers?
58 - X of Sword destruction showed the Vescora digging some big red crystals and then Gia Whitechapel selling to the Crooked Market, could those be
logic diamonds from lost dimensions?

59 - A new captain? Gorgon replaced?

60
Spoiler: show
Locus Vile

Sword is orbiting near Mars as shown in the panel with Peeper and Risque.

I liked that they choose Sersi to explain what was giong on with the election and that nothing was being hidden, it reminded me of the Eternal Unimind.

Dauterman pages were breathtaking, you can see how much mutant love he has and how much care he put in portraing correctly the characters, visually and psychologically, look at Jubilee and Rictor, Gambit kissing Rogue and the face of Polaris.

I would love if Emma is linking everyone with Peepers so they can see thought his eyes the "fireworks"

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Blackcyclops
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by Blackcyclops » 10 Jun 2021, 10:42

Gremlin wrote:
10 Jun 2021, 09:41
I would have actually liked to know the characters’ arguments. Sunfire has historically been hostile and dismissive of the X-Men team, so to not only join but to plead a case to join is a bit odd for him.

I disagree though that the event is wearing thin, for me anyway. I am actually relieved it’s not a single story but a scenario that the titles can use to propel their own stories forward. I will admit it’s a little scattershot as the actually Hellfire Gala itself is somewhat chaotic in that we are jumping backwards and forwards during it and only seeing snippets here and there. I’m loving the politics coming into play too, with the human sides in various titles ramping up their plans.
I feel the same way. It’s making it real enjoyable for me.
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norwichchris
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by norwichchris » 10 Jun 2021, 10:56

When Sunfire was first made a member he bluntly told them where to go afterwards. He has never once shown a desire to be an X-Men in any issues since and other Mutants would want it more and have better reasons and I hope at some point we get to see there arguments about why they should be X-Men compared to others.

Also I take it this included all Mutants present as well not just former X-men or affiliated teams because I did notice all who were chosen are former X-men/Allies etc but no former Acolyts, Brotherhood etc...

I Feel the Gala stories are going somewhere as they are setting up all the right places and pieces for the Inferno event to come. We are seeing what everyone is doing and there viewpoints of what is about to transpire.

I really enjoyed the first scenes with Xavier and Magneto trying to convince Namor to join them and it seems part of there plan is to gain some form of alliance with the Atlanteans? Namor obviously is completely not interested as he suspects sinister motives and he has no real reason to do so anyway.

By far the best part was Cyclops speech about Xavier, his feelings towards him and why his dream came to an end. Ultimately feel this is Cyclops forgiving his former teacher/Mentor for not being perfect.

What is the nameless city and the two delegates from?

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Re: X-Men #21

Post by das_boot » 10 Jun 2021, 10:58

I do feel like the “arguments” that people present will be elaborated on when this title changes into the team book, but that’s exactly what I meant— Sunfire even putting up an argument to join the X-Men just feels really weird. I appreciate that they didn’t just go down the route of a standard “recruitment” issue, but it just felt a bit lacking to me.
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Blackcyclops
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by Blackcyclops » 10 Jun 2021, 11:12

Never forget that Sunfire did just the Unity Squad and let’s not use Sunfire’s original refusal 60 years ago lol…he can be a team player.
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by Lavettye » 10 Jun 2021, 11:45

Due to the various artists, the issue felt somewhat disconnected... and it seemed quiet short. Except for the Namor scene and the vote (the result of which we already knew) there didn't happen much. Maybe It would have felt differently if they hadn't announced the new roster beforehand.

I agree that the members' individual reasons for wanting to be on this team will probably be addressed in upcoming stories. s for Sunfire, I'm no fan of the character, but I wouldn't write him off so quickly. Sure, he initially was more of a loner and was very vocal about not wanting to be on the team, but since then he has been on X-Corporation Mumbai, worked with Alpha Flight, led Big Hero Six and was part of the Avengers Unity squad. He's passionate and a hothead, but given the right cause, he might want to participate.... especially as this isn't neecessarily a band of do-gooder, but Krakoa's own *proud* hero team, defemding and representing them to the outside world.

Also, the way Dr. Strange described the voting process, with those willing to join presenting their reasons, then people rallying behind those reasons and choosing the best representatives, it could also be possible that one person provided a perfect reason for joining (like Scott and Jean need someone to keep them in check) and someone else was picked by the crowd as the best candidate to fill out that role. Laura seemed actually surprised that she was picked.

Additionally, I suspect that the fact that all of the new X-Men could visually pass for regular humans was an important factor. (that applies not only to the final line-up but also the other seven candidates for Polaris' spot)
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by WorldWideWade » 10 Jun 2021, 13:44

Surprised that no one mentioned that Namor went to join a conversation with the former Illuminati after rejecting the offer from Erik and Charles. The only members not in that panel were Beast and Black Bolt (still in the Inhuman time-out corner).
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by Holland Oates » 10 Jun 2021, 13:50

Synch's argument could easily have been "there has only been one black male x-man and he was an aborigine from the future. Plus I just risked my life and sanity in the Vault."


Similarly, asians are extremely underrepresented in the x-men's ranks, given their numbers around the world. This might be a purely political move although Shiro really came through for them when the King in Black showed up.
Last edited by Holland Oates on 10 Jun 2021, 13:54, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: X-Men #21

Post by Holland Oates » 10 Jun 2021, 13:52

WorldWideWade wrote:
10 Jun 2021, 13:44
Surprised that no one mentioned that Namor went to join a conversation with the former Illuminati after rejecting the offer from Erik and Charles. The only members not in that panel were Beast and Black Bolt (still in the Inhuman time-out corner).
Maybe that's what Reed whispered to Xavier. I assumed that it was a threat. Maybe it was about getting the gang back together.

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Blackcyclops
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by Blackcyclops » 10 Jun 2021, 14:43

While that might be what a fan or a social media poster says, I really don’t see those things as being their “arguments” for being X-Men or any other mutants argument for including them. And given our lack of hearing anything, I won’t venture to guess what it might be but I doubt it was that.

@WWW: Oh I noticed it and also noticed it was written by Hickman and drawn in a style that we saw during some of his Avengers years. I wouldn’t rule out a possible reunion of the Illuminati…yet I wonder if Cap (given everything) would want to be included. It could have very well not been an official reunion but imagery meant to invoke that emotion to the reader…but good point.
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Re: X-Men #21

Post by norwichchris » 10 Jun 2021, 14:59

I See Peoples point about Sunfire and maybe people are viewing this from his pre-Krakoa days, you mentioned when he was on the Avengers Unity Squad recall him being very difficult to work with at the start but slowly getting to be a member of the team in the end, however If you consider how he feels about his nation of Japan it would actually fit in very well how he may know view his new home and being an X-Man. Over all the other members though he is an odd one out for me why not Surge or Armor?

It is a standard team in a way that none of the X-men's former foes were invited not even Frenzy?

They have had few Asian characters over the years such as: Jubilee, Psylocke(Kwannon Body), Karma and Surge but not many main characters.

Personally was more interested in Cyclops Speech about how he views his mentor and the Dream coming to an end because of how hostile the world had become which I think is rather sad but true in a way.

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Re: X-Men #21

Post by ultimatekey » 10 Jun 2021, 15:47

Holland Oates wrote:
10 Jun 2021, 13:50
Synch's argument could easily have been "there has only been one black male x-man and he was an aborigine from the future. Plus I just risked my life and sanity in the Vault."


Similarly, asians are extremely underrepresented in the x-men's ranks, given their numbers around the world. This might be a purely political move although Shiro really came through for them when the King in Black showed up.
You know, now that you mentioned that?

Has there been any African-American members on the X-Men?

And by that I mean, black people from America.

I guess Bishop does not count because he is of aborigine-descent (Australian descent).

The only people I can think of is Synch, Bling!, Cipher, and Prodigy, Bedlam.

One could argue that Synch or Prodigy are the first members of the X-Men franchise who are purely African-American. Storm does not count because by many she is considered African. She was born in America to an African-American father and a Kenyan mother, but she grew up in Africa. She acts and portrays herself as more African than African-American. She moreso identifies as African than African-American, if that makes sense.

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