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X-men Red #5

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Flapflop
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X-men Red #5

Post by Flapflop » 03 Aug 2022, 08:45

In a nutshell:
Spoiler: show
its almost total eXtinction on Arakko, also because Isca switch sides to Uranos/The Eternals so she can't loose.

But when all Hope seems lost we get an uneXpected, though maybe little bit Deus Ex Machina, ending.
Let's see where this is going now. I'm eXited.
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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Blackcyclops » 03 Aug 2022, 13:18

If you call that a Deus Ex Machina, I think you misunderstand Ewing’s writing style…

This right here…damn, this is what I wanted when Morrison extinguished Genosha. I know, I know, that was meant to be tragedy. But damn, this is how you do a tie-in…sheesh! Idk
So on one hand we have the existence of a being who can reset the entire timeline, destroying everything…, and on the other hand we have a few mind wipes and some gaslighting. You're right, totally evenly weighted.
-Cly

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Blackcyclops » 03 Aug 2022, 14:09

That last page…the sexiest thing I’ve seen in an X-Men comic in years. #TheHourofMagnetoBegins
So on one hand we have the existence of a being who can reset the entire timeline, destroying everything…, and on the other hand we have a few mind wipes and some gaslighting. You're right, totally evenly weighted.
-Cly

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Oldmanlogan79 » 03 Aug 2022, 14:30

yes, it is the sexiest thing....But how was he able to do that? any clues?!
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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by EphemeristX » 03 Aug 2022, 17:01

The book said 98% loss in a fifty mile radius. That's alot of people, but that's not near extinction of Arakko, especially given that they've basically spread all over the planet. Many of the settlements are shown being evacuated. Only one named Arakkoan that we know of has even fallen yet, and that's Idyll.
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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Holland Oates » 03 Aug 2022, 17:53

Oldmanlogan79 wrote:
03 Aug 2022, 14:30
yes, it is the sexiest thing....But how was he able to do that? any clues?!
No clue. Maybe there were special instructions in his last resurrection.

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Crutey Anth » 03 Aug 2022, 19:26

Oldmanlogan79 wrote:
03 Aug 2022, 14:30
yes, it is the sexiest thing....But how was he able to do that? any clues?!
Secondary mutation...when in doubt, secondary mutation.

This is Magneto's 'Okay suckers, you've taken your best shot!...now its my turn!' panel.

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Blackcyclops » 03 Aug 2022, 19:34

He looks like he’s literally keeping his blood circulating with his magnetism. Which if you think about all the “control the iron in your blood” we’ve seen of Magneto over the decades, this isn’t even that much of a stretch for him.
So on one hand we have the existence of a being who can reset the entire timeline, destroying everything…, and on the other hand we have a few mind wipes and some gaslighting. You're right, totally evenly weighted.
-Cly

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by _Rick_ » 03 Aug 2022, 20:56

I read it in the same way as BC: He is using his magnetism to pump his blood (in lieu of his heart doing it). Idyll clearly knew what was going to happen and Ora said the prophecy was "an empty heart beats hardest" which seems to fit. It's a bit too farfetched for my liking to be honest, but it wouldn't be the first time writers did the whole "blood has iron in it so Magneto can control blood". Remember this?
Image

Anyway, whilst the 98% death toll seems impressive, the impact is dimminished by the fact that we don't know many characters on Arakko. Ultimately, Idyll is the only named character that is permanently dead, right?

I feel like that one is almost on the members of the ring holding the idiot ball. Ora did say "The Stalemate ends with Victory's loss". I feel like at least one of the characters should have made the association between Isca and Idyll and their respective seats.

What was up with the panel with the Fisher King? It says "night has fallen". Could it be related to the three seats of the Night? We still don't know who has those seats.

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Blackcyclops » 03 Aug 2022, 21:01

Well call me an idiot because I didn’t automatically make that leap…certainly not in the seconds they had lol

Magneto’s controlling of the iron in the blood is a pretty regular thing for him. Going back at least to X-Men #1 in the 90s I think.

And I guess I’m just different…even without knowing all their names, a sea of skeletons and bones is a jarring image and does show scale and stakes to me at least…but maybe that’s just me lol
So on one hand we have the existence of a being who can reset the entire timeline, destroying everything…, and on the other hand we have a few mind wipes and some gaslighting. You're right, totally evenly weighted.
-Cly

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by _Rick_ » 03 Aug 2022, 21:48

To be fair BC, it's their job titles. I would expect them to make that connection naturally. I wonder who could replace Idyll. The Arakki seem to like having a seer.

As for the deaths, I think it would have worked better if we had explored more of Arakko and had a few named characters that were offed at least.

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Leo » 04 Aug 2022, 08:45

This is a great issue, and a great tie-in (same with Immortal Xmen). I really enjoyed seeing the great ring battled Uranos and can't wait to see what the Arakki will do as their next move. I also hope Legion of X will pick up Legion's battle with Uranos once it has concluded its current story-line. I'm not really familiar with Uranos (aside from what I've read in Gillen's Eternals - but never seen him in action). Does he psionicaly controlled all the weaponaries in his armory? is that part of his powers or is that just eternal technology?
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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Blackcyclops » 04 Aug 2022, 11:53

No clue…but all Eternals have basically the same suite of powers, so he certainly has psychic powers.
So on one hand we have the existence of a being who can reset the entire timeline, destroying everything…, and on the other hand we have a few mind wipes and some gaslighting. You're right, totally evenly weighted.
-Cly

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by norwichchris » 04 Aug 2022, 12:01

After reading this did anyone spot that Uranus was using self-replicating Machines on the Arakki? as I recall from HOX/POX they are a threat to Mutantkind's existence and this proves it beyond all doubt so no don't see them making peace anytime soon.

I too am confused by his power assume he has powers similar to Magneto and is at least a technopath to be able to control machines.

I'm so glad Magneto is still alive this does remind me of the Genosha genocide.

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Blackcyclops » 04 Aug 2022, 12:21

Again, Eternals all have the same suite of powers…but some have specializations in particular areas. Here’s a breakdown by the Ol’ Mighty Monolith:
Spoiler: show
The Eternals are a genetic offshoot of early humanity, created by the Celestials in the same experiments that produced the Deviants and forever altered proto-humans to possess the “spark” for impressive mutation and evolution in generations to come. The Deviants were ever-changing and mass-producing, constantly procreating and yet genetically unstable so that each Deviant could be considered a species of one, radically different from its parents or other Deviants in physical appearance, abilities, lifespan, etc. The Eternals, on the other hand, were genetically stable to the point of being stagnant. An Eternal’s physiology and metabolism is maintained by self-replicating cosmic energy in every cell. They are immortal and nearly indestructible, requiring something equivalent to complete atomic dispersal to kill them. Recent revelations have also shown that, even then, the Great Machine of Earth has resurrection chambers which can revive fallen Eternals. The Eternals were once thought to have an extremely low birthrate, producing new offspring in their race once ever millennium or so. Again, retcons have altered this understanding, showing that there are, and have always been, exactly 100 Eternals since the creation of their race. Eternals have had some success in breeding with other species, such as Ikaris or Ceyote’s half-human children or Thena and Kro’s half-Deviant twins, but these offspring are not “true Eternals” recognized within the Great Machine. Even long established family bonds like Zuras and Thena are not truly father – daughter; family units were assigned to many Eternals upon creation by the Celestials, presumably to build familiarity and support networks. The only known example of True Eternals breeding true is Mentor and Sui-San’s sons Eros and Thanos…to their eternal regret.

Eternals have many natural abilities at their disposal due to their cosmic energy storages. Eternals typically have access to some combination of superhuman strength, endurance, durability, telepathy, telekinesis, teleportation, illusion-casting, molecular manipulation, and the projection of cosmic energy across the electromagnetic spectrum. In the same way a human can become stronger by working out, individual Eternals can develop particular skills through practice. At one point, it was believed the Eternals of Earth developed these cosmic powers after experiments by the Eternal Kronos mutated their race, but this was a distortion of their memories and has proven to be untrue. Their elected ruler, dubbed the Prime Eternal, can initiate a merger among Eternals, causing them to combine and form an organic gestalt entity called the Uni-Mind. This combines and enhances the power of all Eternals into a single consciousness. Other beings, such as humans or even Deviants, have also joined in a Uni-Mind that is majority Eternals. Recent revelations have indicated that the Prime Eternal is beneficial but not necessary for the Uni-Mind…a few as four Eternals (none of them Prime) had their individual aspects enhanced simply by being in close proximity to each other.
You can read it for yourself here:
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1031&start=250

So Uranos most definitely has psychic powers. And given it is his armory, he probably is linked to these weapons.
So on one hand we have the existence of a being who can reset the entire timeline, destroying everything…, and on the other hand we have a few mind wipes and some gaslighting. You're right, totally evenly weighted.
-Cly

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by das_boot » 04 Aug 2022, 16:32

Re; Magneto’s survival, I thought those thread things might have been pieces of bug-mutant that were keeping him alive, but magnetically controlling his blood certainly makes more sense!

Saying this was probably my least favourite issue of the week just speaks to the quality of writers with work published this week. This wasn’t weak AT ALL, and while the absolute carnage unleashed was terrifying… I just don’t really care enough about the Arraki mutants at this point to find myself so sad about their losses. It’s not a criticism of Ewing’s writing or the pacing of the event, I just feel as though if we’d maybe had one or two issues prior to this focused solely on the circle of Arrako without the lens of the X-Men, I’d be more inclined to feel a bit more on a personal level for them, if that makes sense?

Isca’s power continues to be ill-defined and it would be interesting to see whether she switches back now that Uranos is gone from Arrako. Either way it would be interesting to see whether she’s officially pulled to the side of the Eternals or whether it was a proximity effect. Needless to say, what could have been one of Arrako’s strongest weapons either needs to be benched for the duration of this conflict, taken off the board entirely, or she’s defected fully. For a power that seems on paper to be so noble and highly prized, it’s almost one that’s become linked to treachery as far as I can see, and I feel like that would also be the opinion of the Arraki mutants too.
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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Holland Oates » 04 Aug 2022, 18:18

Now his last name (Eisenhardt) is even more ironic. They better boot Isca after this is all done. I doubt that this is the end of Arakko. So her powers must operate on a battle by battle basis. Uranos won the opening salvo so she had to turn traitor. And she would have to turn back if the fight starts to favor the mutants.

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Blackcyclops » 04 Aug 2022, 19:04

Holland Oates wrote:
04 Aug 2022, 18:18
Now his last name (Eisenhardt) is even more ironic. They better boot Isca after this is all done. I doubt that this is the end of Arakko. So her powers must operate on a battle by battle basis. Uranos won the opening salvo so she had to turn traitor. And she would have to turn back if the fight starts to favor the mutants.
That’s the thing though…does she switch sides and that side wins OR by her switching sides, that side wins? Like it seems like the former is true but if the wager situation is correct, wouldn’t it be the latter?
So on one hand we have the existence of a being who can reset the entire timeline, destroying everything…, and on the other hand we have a few mind wipes and some gaslighting. You're right, totally evenly weighted.
-Cly

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Fenix » 04 Aug 2022, 20:37

So far Isca's power is betraying.
I haven't seen her being really badass.

Uranos was impressive but maybe overpowered, I can't wait to see Magneto open a black hole into his head.

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Magnus » 05 Aug 2022, 00:34

I wonder what happened between Legion and Uranos... maybe we'll see in Legion of X #6?
Crutey Anth wrote:
03 Aug 2022, 19:26
Secondary mutation...when in doubt, secondary mutation.
I remember in the (short) time between Morrison's "Planet X" arc and Xorneto being retconned as a Sublime-influenced Kuan-Yin, there were plenty of jokes about Magneto's secondary mutation being able to regrow his head. :lol:
Blackcyclops wrote:
03 Aug 2022, 19:34
He looks like he’s literally keeping his blood circulating with his magnetism. Which if you think about all the “control the iron in your blood” we’ve seen of Magneto over the decades, this isn’t even that much of a stretch for him.
Yup, definitely seems to be the case... I wonder if he's living on borrowed time though before he exhausts himself and can't do it anymore. The "hour" of Magneto may be running out...

I agree with Rick that Magneto being able to do so much with "controlling iron in the blood" has always felt a little silly/OP (there's a good argument to be made he doesn't control magnetism so much as he's basically a reality warper limited to metal), but it is certainly consistent over time.

Also Uranos just stood there and let Cable shoot his BFG at him for three and a half minutes so it all evens out in the end as long as it's suitably dramatic. :lol:
_Rick_ wrote:
03 Aug 2022, 20:56
What was up with the panel with the Fisher King? It says "night has fallen". Could it be related to the three seats of the Night? We still don't know who has those seats.
That was my guess. There's been a lot of speculation that he's one of the three secret Night seats; this all but confirms it for me.
Holland Oates wrote:
04 Aug 2022, 18:18
Now his last name (Eisenhardt) is even more ironic. They better boot Isca after this is all done. I doubt that this is the end of Arakko. So her powers must operate on a battle by battle basis. Uranos won the opening salvo so she had to turn traitor. And she would have to turn back if the fight starts to favor the mutants.
Wow the pun in Magneto's real last name didn't even occur to me, that's great.

And yeah, somewhat agreed on Isca... switching is interesting the first time, but after awhile it must just get old. Makes you wonder how many times she did it before in Amenth and how many people she's pissed off over the years. Surely someone by now would've figured out how to get rid of the unbeatable...

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by das_boot » 05 Aug 2022, 07:50

This is where I’m starting to lean in to the theory that Isca’s power is like Darwin’s in that it takes the path of least resistance to ensure a victory. It seems like a mash up of Darwin, Lifeguard and Longshot’s powers.

In the instance where she influenced the arena battle between Tarn and Magneto (I mean, potentially at least, I still think that seems ambiguous) her power… what? Made Magneto win? That’s pretty much some Longshot level probability manipulation.

The X-Men attacking in Otherworld/Uranos attacking Arrako? Her power just compelled her to switch to the winning side as an act of self-preservation. If her power worked ENTIRELY like Longshot or Domino’s sure, she would have probability alter around her to make her more likely to win, but in situations where she would potentially be overwhelmed and the odds are too high, her power compels her to move to the side most likely to win.

I’m starting to lean more to her power not being that she can’t be beaten, but it’s some hybrid of probability manipulation, physical enhancement (so your standard “harder better faster stronger” package), and basically making sure that she’s in the best situation to survive.
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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Holland Oates » 05 Aug 2022, 17:42

das_boot wrote:
05 Aug 2022, 07:50
This is where I’m starting to lean in to the theory that Isca’s power is like Darwin’s in that it takes the path of least resistance to ensure a victory. It seems like a mash up of Darwin, Lifeguard and Longshot’s powers.

In the instance where she influenced the arena battle between Tarn and Magneto (I mean, potentially at least, I still think that seems ambiguous) her power… what? Made Magneto win? That’s pretty much some Longshot level probability manipulation.

The X-Men attacking in Otherworld/Uranos attacking Arrako? Her power just compelled her to switch to the winning side as an act of self-preservation. If her power worked ENTIRELY like Longshot or Domino’s sure, she would have probability alter around her to make her more likely to win, but in situations where she would potentially be overwhelmed and the odds are too high, her power compels her to move to the side most likely to win.

I’m starting to lean more to her power not being that she can’t be beaten, but it’s some hybrid of probability manipulation, physical enhancement (so your standard “harder better faster stronger” package), and basically making sure that she’s in the best situation to survive.
Could be that her power slowed Tarn’s reaction time or caused his power to “jam” for lack of a better description.

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Holland Oates » 05 Aug 2022, 17:55

Blackcyclops wrote:
04 Aug 2022, 19:04
Holland Oates wrote:
04 Aug 2022, 18:18
Now his last name (Eisenhardt) is even more ironic. They better boot Isca after this is all done. I doubt that this is the end of Arakko. So her powers must operate on a battle by battle basis. Uranos won the opening salvo so she had to turn traitor. And she would have to turn back if the fight starts to favor the mutants.
That’s the thing though…does she switch sides and that side wins OR by her switching sides, that side wins? Like it seems like the former is true but if the wager situation is correct, wouldn’t it be the latter?
I would say that the former is true. Because we’ve seen it twice. She’s a fate puppet. It prods her to act when there’s a chance of defeat. Bobby took advantage of it by “outsmarting” fate. He basically called Isca’s manager and got his free coupon. I don’t see it as something conscious on Isca’s part. I’ve seen no evidence that she can choose to lose.

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by Blackcyclops » 05 Aug 2022, 18:11

Well neither presupposes she has a choice…but makes a difference between her power changing things and her power changing because of things.
So on one hand we have the existence of a being who can reset the entire timeline, destroying everything…, and on the other hand we have a few mind wipes and some gaslighting. You're right, totally evenly weighted.
-Cly

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Re: X-men Red #5

Post by das_boot » 05 Aug 2022, 19:54

Holland Oates wrote:
05 Aug 2022, 17:42
das_boot wrote:
05 Aug 2022, 07:50
This is where I’m starting to lean in to the theory that Isca’s power is like Darwin’s in that it takes the path of least resistance to ensure a victory. It seems like a mash up of Darwin, Lifeguard and Longshot’s powers.

In the instance where she influenced the arena battle between Tarn and Magneto (I mean, potentially at least, I still think that seems ambiguous) her power… what? Made Magneto win? That’s pretty much some Longshot level probability manipulation.

The X-Men attacking in Otherworld/Uranos attacking Arrako? Her power just compelled her to switch to the winning side as an act of self-preservation. If her power worked ENTIRELY like Longshot or Domino’s sure, she would have probability alter around her to make her more likely to win, but in situations where she would potentially be overwhelmed and the odds are too high, her power compels her to move to the side most likely to win.

I’m starting to lean more to her power not being that she can’t be beaten, but it’s some hybrid of probability manipulation, physical enhancement (so your standard “harder better faster stronger” package), and basically making sure that she’s in the best situation to survive.
Could be that her power slowed Tarn’s reaction time or caused his power to “jam” for lack of a better description.
Yeah, that’s kind of what I was aiming at. Like… it’s almost an amped up version of Domino’s power in that she has to take action (no matter how small, in the case of accidentally betting on an outcome) for her power to activate, or that her power might activate to show her the only course of action is to defect.

Sorry, really vague powers bother me, and unfortunately that goes doubly so when they’re written well by a great writer who I trust has plans but is just developing a mystery 😂
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