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X-Men #18

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Blackcyclops
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X-Men #18

Post by Blackcyclops » 24 Feb 2021, 12:47

Well, go Synch!!!!
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Gremlin
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by Gremlin » 24 Feb 2021, 13:55

I found this kinda boring. It felt like the issue was really short and I can’t really say if I learned much from it other than the COTV are a threat.
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by comicsfan666 » 24 Feb 2021, 14:10

Thanks for the summary, saves me the bother of reading it.

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das_boot
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by das_boot » 24 Feb 2021, 19:06

Nice little insight into Synch but other than that, for the amount of build up, this wasn’t even disappointing, it was just poor.
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Blackcyclops
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by Blackcyclops » 24 Feb 2021, 20:21

It felt too short...

The best thing was the data page.
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das_boot
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by das_boot » 24 Feb 2021, 20:39

It wasn’t even that it felt short, it just felt like after picking this plot up again after so long, the pay-off just wasn’t enough.

At the start I was actually feeling myself get psyched for some Synch spotlight. Not only has it been a while since this plot started, but it’s been so long since Synch has been alive and relevant that it just felt good to get some insight into him... but everything about this issue felt lacking. The art was stunning, but everything else just felt so... I dunno. I really don’t know how to phrase how I felt other than it was just not worth the pay off for the hype this issue got pre-release.
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by Oldmanlogan79 » 24 Feb 2021, 21:06

Blackcyclops wrote:
24 Feb 2021, 20:21
It felt too short...
Brilliant art and good fight...but you said it...
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ultimatekey
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by ultimatekey » 24 Feb 2021, 21:11

Is Synch attracted to X-23 now?

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Re: X-Men #18

Post by EphemeristX » 24 Feb 2021, 21:13

So, I agree that it definitely felt short. But I didn't read this as a one-and-done issue. I feel like what we've read is just the beginning of their tale. What came after the initial altercation is the true meat of the story, which I think is being hinted at throughout the issue itself. I guess we'll find out next month.
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by Fenix » 24 Feb 2021, 21:21

The problem here is that we were expecting some answers and some proper push forward to this plot and well...

... I was reading the last page and thinking: "Where is the rest?"

On one side I like when a story unfolds slowly, Claremont did that back in the 80s seeding plots and picking them up later on (or not, as some were left there...) and it is obvious Hickman is Claremont's fan as he does have a very similar kind of narrative, even if Claremont and Hickman do have lots of diferences (e.g. Claremont did write his characters perfectly (it was his highlight when he was on his prime before dropping Uncanny/Xmen), Hickman is more sloppy as he focus more into the plot sometimes writing his characters slightly
Spoiler: show
(or terribly...)
out of character but he is able to rise the level of his plots to epicness)

I really hope the next issue does give some answers and resolution to this plot

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Re: X-Men #18

Post by norwichchris » 25 Feb 2021, 06:50

Oddly enough liked it but it was like the start of a book. It seems to me that Synch and co are still trapped inside the COTV home and are relaying there memories of what happened.

It did show us a glimpse of the COTV home it has a million odd inhabitants and there seems to be some population control going on which is weird when you consider they plan on taking the planet from Mutantkind.

The Datapage at the end seemed to clear up the problem of advanced humans as they are not defined as humans so are killable think really well. Still not a fan of them though.

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Magnus
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by Magnus » 26 Feb 2021, 00:04

Yeah this was insultingly decompressed.

At least next issue also looks to be another CotV issue so we won't have to wait another 13 months.

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Re: X-Men #18

Post by Cable » 27 Feb 2021, 20:42

This issue was lacking for me because I simply don't care about the Children of the Vault in any way. But I also didn't have strong feelings against it for that same reason. I am not a fan though of further power creep that has been going on for many X-Men over the years. But hey at least something is being done with Synch and he isn't just standing around in the back.
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by das_boot » 28 Feb 2021, 19:57

See, I think I’m disappointed because I DO love the children of the vault, and part of that for me was that they were so distinct from mutants— but Synch being able to copy their powers didn’t really feel like such a clever twist or something that interesting to me since we’ve already seen Rogue copy their powers in Carey’s run. I know we have more wiggle room with Rogue in that we know she can absorb non-mutant powers whereas we haven’t seen Synch ever do that, but that’s part of why that reveal kind of felt a little bit short for me 🤷‍♂️
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by tokenBG1009 » 28 Feb 2021, 21:53

Man, I wish I could have waited until next month to read this, but it was the only story I was really interested in anymore so I grabbed it.

Image

Guess I'll be back next month.
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norwichchris
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by norwichchris » 01 Mar 2021, 09:33

To me personally it feels like the beginning of a story so will get better as time goes on.

Synch powers emits an aura that enables him to copy the powers of other super-powered beings so it is conceivable and highly likely he could copy other non-mutant powers and honestly he wasn't really around long enough to find out. I never really read many Gen X comics but may get the TPB when I can get around to reading them.

The COTV do feel more like a credible threat to mutants than other groups and certainly have the power and means to fight back against Krakoa. One thing don't get are there powers mechanical based or organic like genetically engineered?

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Re: X-Men #18

Post by Holland Oates » 01 Mar 2021, 15:31

norwichchris wrote:
01 Mar 2021, 09:33
To me personally it feels like the beginning of a story so will get better as time goes on.

Synch powers emits an aura that enables him to copy the powers of other super-powered beings so it is conceivable and highly likely he could copy other non-mutant powers and honestly he wasn't really around long enough to find out. I never really read many Gen X comics but may get the TPB when I can get around to reading them.

The COTV do feel more like a credible threat to mutants than other groups and certainly have the power and means to fight back against Krakoa. One thing don't get are there powers mechanical based or organic like genetically engineered?
An advanced technology forced them (baseline humans) to evolve past humans and mutants. Sooo...a little of both. Their evolution was techassisted but the powers are coming from their individual genetics. that's at least my interpretation.

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Re: X-Men #18

Post by tokenBG1009 » 01 Mar 2021, 23:28

They're mutants by another name.
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Blackcyclops
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by Blackcyclops » 02 Mar 2021, 00:10

tokenBG1009 wrote:
01 Mar 2021, 23:28
They're mutants by another name.
I mean not necessarily, they aren’t homo superior.
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by norwichchris » 02 Mar 2021, 11:18

Blackcyclops wrote:
02 Mar 2021, 00:10
tokenBG1009 wrote:
01 Mar 2021, 23:28
They're mutants by another name.
I mean not necessarily, they aren’t homo superior.
Think the correct term would be Superhumans? or advanced-humans? what category would other heroes fall into? if you consider the rest of the MU could they be a potential threat to Mutants dominating the earth? what if we had an army of Captain Americas or Spidermen?

Not counting Aliens/Gods as that wouldn't make much sense.

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Re: X-Men #18

Post by Blackcyclops » 02 Mar 2021, 14:45

I don’t think you get the central idea here. And superhumans like Spidey are mutates not mutants (both trace their origins to the Celestials, the difference is the x-gene).

It isn’t that Hickman (or Morrison before) is somehow saying that mutants will “dominate” the world in the way that Sentinels did in DofP or even mutants in Apocalypse’s future, where essentially mutants or machines committed mass genocide against the other peoples of Earth and then just like repressed them through violence.

If that was the idea than yeah an army of Spider-men or Caps or Hulks would be a “threat”.

But going off the ideas the author’s actually have presented (that at this point have been argued soooo many times it feels like you’re trolling), the random superhuman events that we have now are not really in danger of impeding mutants from eventually becoming humanity’s successors unless they I guess stopped the mutant gene from ever again popping up and everybody somehow got powers through gamma radiation or spider bites (but we know that not everyone survives the mutate-creation process btw).
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by tokenBG1009 » 02 Mar 2021, 15:50

Blackcyclops wrote:
02 Mar 2021, 00:10
tokenBG1009 wrote:
01 Mar 2021, 23:28
They're mutants by another name.
I mean not necessarily, they aren’t homo superior.
That's the "another name" part.

It's been YEARS since I read Carey's run, but I was always under the impression that the Children were just evolved humans that developed superpowers. If they received these powers through purposeful genetic mutation over generations then, sure, they wouldn't actually be mutants. If they naturally gained those powers... they're just mutants by another name. It's similar to how Vargas would say he wasn't a wasn't a mutant, he was just... the next step.

Granted, this is just my view on it. If you sat an X-Man and a COTV down and asked them the nature of their powers they'd both claim evolution from normal humans. COTV just took more time to get there.
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by norwichchris » 02 Mar 2021, 15:55

I get the central idea that Mutants will eventually in the far future become humanity's successor but will hostile races opposing them. I hate it because it completely destroys Xaviers dream of mutants coexisting with humans which is impossible in this scenario as humans will always find a away to prevent there extinction.
Blackcyclops wrote:
02 Mar 2021, 14:45
But going off the ideas the author’s actually have presented (that at this point have been argued soooo many times it feels like you’re trolling), the random superhuman events that we have now are not really in danger of impeding mutants from eventually becoming humanity’s successors unless they I guess stopped the mutant gene from ever again popping up and everybody somehow got powers through gamma radiation or spider bites (but we know that not everyone survives the mutate-creation process btw).
Yes admit found this very difficult to understand mainly as I read HOX/POX seperately and got incredibly confused. Respectfully disagree of the dangers of mutates to mutants if you consider how much damage Scarlet Witch did to them using a few magical words. The Inhumans and Fantastic 4 also defeated them on numerous occasions although there wasn't a clear winner.

If it wasn't the case why are they so obsessed with finding the COTV if not to wipe them out before they can become a threat to them?

As I understood it humanity eventually breaks into two races mutants and post-humans (COTV) will come to dominate the world. Along with AI later on to take over all of them to be united with the Phalanx?

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Re: X-Men #18

Post by Blackcyclops » 02 Mar 2021, 16:46

tokenBG1009 wrote:
02 Mar 2021, 15:50
Blackcyclops wrote:
02 Mar 2021, 00:10
tokenBG1009 wrote:
01 Mar 2021, 23:28
They're mutants by another name.
I mean not necessarily, they aren’t homo superior.
That's the "another name" part.

It's been YEARS since I read Carey's run, but I was always under the impression that the Children were just evolved humans that developed superpowers. If they received these powers through purposeful genetic mutation over generations then, sure, they wouldn't actually be mutants. If they naturally gained those powers... they're just mutants by another name. It's similar to how Vargas would say he wasn't a wasn't a mutant, he was just... the next step.

Granted, this is just my view on it. If you sat an X-Man and a COTV down and asked them the nature of their powers they'd both claim evolution from normal humans. COTV just took more time to get there.

But that’s a clear and apparent distinction.

Mutants can’t be mutants without the x-gene.

CotV don’t possess the X-gene.

Yea, CotV started out as baseline humans but due to the accelerated time properties of their ship (and whatever other interventions the ship had because as we saw this issue their ship isn’t a absent presence in their lives) they developed distinct powers. But to call them mutants would be like saying Eternals or Deviants are mutants. Sure in the purest sense of what a mutant is (in that case, depending on how far you want to go, ever human is a mutant due to mutations in our genes over time) they’re mutants but as it’s understood in the MU and in all our discussions of mutants, they aren’t mutants.

Should we like differentiate by calling folks with the x-gene Mutants and everything else mutants?
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Blackcyclops
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Re: X-Men #18

Post by Blackcyclops » 02 Mar 2021, 17:05

norwichchris wrote:
02 Mar 2021, 15:55
I get the central idea that Mutants will eventually in the far future become humanity's successor but will hostile races opposing them. I hate it because it completely destroys Xaviers dream of mutants coexisting with humans which is impossible in this scenario as humans will always find a away to prevent there extinction.
Blackcyclops wrote:
02 Mar 2021, 14:45
But going off the ideas the author’s actually have presented (that at this point have been argued soooo many times it feels like you’re trolling), the random superhuman events that we have now are not really in danger of impeding mutants from eventually becoming humanity’s successors unless they I guess stopped the mutant gene from ever again popping up and everybody somehow got powers through gamma radiation or spider bites (but we know that not everyone survives the mutate-creation process btw).
Yes admit found this very difficult to understand mainly as I read HOX/POX seperately and got incredibly confused. Respectfully disagree of the dangers of mutates to mutants if you consider how much damage Scarlet Witch did to them using a few magical words. The Inhumans and Fantastic 4 also defeated them on numerous occasions although there wasn't a clear winner.

If it wasn't the case why are they so obsessed with finding the COTV if not to wipe them out before they can become a threat to them?

As I understood it humanity eventually breaks into two races mutants and post-humans (COTV) will come to dominate the world. Along with AI later on to take over all of them to be united with the Phalanx?
Dude, And this is in no way meant to be offensive but I feel like you’re not even trying to understand things at this point and just want to reiterate your same point that you don’t like something and human vs mutant war and so on. It’s like you make me feel like I’m going mad because you find new ways to say the same thing and just kind twist the original point (whatever it is) just to bring it up all over again.

So I’ll say it one last time and then I’m out.

What I said is that yes, other forms of superhumans could potentially impede the eventual supplanting of the human race by mutants by ending the ability of mutants to reproduce in the population (hell regular humans could do it too or so could aliens or gods or whomever). That’s not something anyone has refuted.

They could also greatly slow the process down by say killing off mutants in large numbers every time they pop up but they would eventually have to just stop the return of mutants or evolve all of humanity artificially like the CotV or the homo novissimo.

Because otherwise, you could kill every mutant today but new ones would just keep popping up until you get to the same end point of humanity going extinct and mutants being the now dominant homo species.

This isn’t about a war (as you seem to keep implying it to be) or something confrontational like that. This is just (as plain as I can say it): absent all other intervening forces, mutants will replace humans.

And I was saying an army of Captain Americas would be useless in that regard. Sure, you could come up with any scenario of mutate superhumans waging war on mutants and like killing them off or whatever. But unless you cut out the root cause (which is the x-gene reproducing itself in the human genepool), mutants would just return. This isn’t an invasion like you’re implying, so brute force threats doesn’t mean ish.

And thus, this has no bearing on Xavier’s dream at all (at least in the way you’re implying). Because irrespective of the dream, absent intervening forces, humans will just be replaced by mutants. Period. Mutants and humans could be in total harmony and AI could be extinguished and it be just puppies and rainbows for everybody and it wouldn’t change the fact that at some point in the future, humans just will be replaced. That’s the current canon, whether you like it or not.

As for the CotV, they want to wipe them out because the CotV have already been an immediate threat to mutants (you talk like they weren’t the original aggressors lol) and could potentially be a future threat if they are also a part of the artificial evolutionary endpoint of the homo novissimo.

If you wanna retcon it or whatever their is a whole thread that you’ve already been posting in about it. Otherwise, I really don’t have the energy to keep explaining this.
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