Typhoid Mary and Legion

[ultimatekey]

When Legion was first introduced into the Marvel Universe, he was shown with powers of telekinesis, telepathy, and pyrokinesis.

Years later, when Typhoid Mary was introduced, she also displayed the powers of telekinesis, telepathy, and pyrokinesis..........and she has mulitple personality disorder.

With all of that being said, was Legion an influence on the creation of Typhoid Mary and her superpowers?

I find it odd that Typhoid Mary has the power of pyrokinesis even though it is not closely related to telekinesis nor telepathy. It would have made more sense to me if she also had cryokinesis to contradict/complement it but she doesn't.

Pyrokinesis can be understood as aggravating molecules and manipulating those molecules to heat things up. Cryokinesis can be understood as slowing down molecules and using those molecules to slow down or stop/halt the bonds between molecules.

So was fire the first thing the creators thought of after they gave the characters telekinesis and telepathy and they just rolled with it.

I thought that the fact that these two characters had the same initial powers during their first appearances was odd, not coincidental.

[EphemeristX]

Pyrokinesis is sorta related to telekinesis in that they are both psionic control over the physical world. Some versions of pyrokinetics, especially the ones that can create fire, are stated to do so by exciting individual atoms. In that way, it is like a very specialized form of telekinesis.

[Nu-D]

There’s no link that I know of between the characters. If Nocenti was influenced by Legion when she created Mary, I’m not aware of her ever acknowledging it.

[Gibbering Fool]

Pyrokinesis was "big" in the 80s if I recall. Or at least it appeared in several schlock horror films like Firestarter.

I guess you could argue there's a difference between the pyrokinesis that Legion and Mary have, and say Sunfire's powers. Sunfire generates the fire from his body, while Mary and Legion can start a fire anywhere with their mind.

[Nu-D]

Of course, there was Pyro who couldn’t make fire, only control it. So what the hell is that?

[Blackcyclops]

I mean that still could technically be called pyrokinesis...

I mean we know that "element"+kinesis: means the person can control that element and usually can also generate it. In Pyro's case he can control it but not generate it. Which if we're going to be all technical, it would be hard to tell if an aerokinetic is just manipulating the air or generating it.

[Nu-D]

Sure, but if it all amounts to telekinetically moving molecules, then what’s the difference between controlling and generating fire?

[Blackcyclops]

Sure, but if it all amounts to telekinetically moving molecules, then what’s the difference between controlling and generating fire?

Good question...

Again being super technical, I guess the difference is two-fold: whether it generates from the body (like a Firestar) or is only created outside the body and I guess if the pyrokinetic can only manipulate already existing fire, instead of creating it and manipulating it.

I guess you could explain it that Pyro’s power only is attuned to already existing fires. His telekinetic movement of molecules is super specific.

[Jazzkantine]

Maybe controlling fire is just a weaker version of pyrokinetic? There are low-level telepaths who can use their abilities only on eye contact.

So maybe those low-level pyrokinetics can move the atoms very slower and thus that power works only at existing fire.
And mightier pyrokinetics can move the atoms so fast that they start fire themselves.

[EphemeristX]

There aren't a ton of pyrokinetics who can't also generate fire, so it may be a mental block on Pyro's part. Or it's that moving existing flame is easier and he never actually learned how to create it too. That's where going to a mutant school would help.

[Jazzkantine]

Isn’t Firestar creating/absorbing microwaves and not fire directly? In her latest appearances she was shown to be like Pyro, a living flamethrower, but in the cartoon she was shown shooting microwaved beams pewpewpew

[Blackcyclops]

Well microwaves can create fire...so that’s why she had fire-like powers in New warriors.

[Gibbering Fool]

The key thing to consider I guess would be is the fire being generated via their body (e.g. via a chemical reaction, by simply generating heat or by generating microwaves/radiation like Firestar or Sunfire) or is is it solely from their mind? I guess most processes can get labelled pyrokinesis, but the version that Legion amd Mary employ is very different to say Rusty Collins

[Blackcyclops]

And Pyro falls into an interesting gray area

[Nu-D]

OK, here’s my effort:

Unlike water, earth and air, fire is not matter; it’s energy AND matter. It’s molecular kinetic energy manifested as light and heat. But it’s also combustion: the combining and re-combining of atoms into other molecules. When you burn wood, heat energy causes the cellulose molecules to bond with oxygen molecules, and they give off heat, light and leave carbon (ash) and carbon-dioxide (and other gasses).

As noted, there are two main categories of pyro-based powers.

There are pyrokinetics such as Legion and Mary, who do not appear to use their bodies to generate fire. They can do so at a distance, causing something to erupt into flames just by looking at it. I think that the “telekinetically agitating molecules” explanation is quite suitable for this. I propose that Legion and Mary are mentally able to agitate the molecules of the thing they’re looking at sufficiently to catalyze the chemical reaction with the surrounding air.

Then there are the fire-based powers that seem to be generated by the body, not purely psychically. These people work like a flame thrower. They use the nerves and muscles in the body to generate heat energy. They also emit a gas that combusts with oxygen, like propane or methane. That’s right, it’s never mentioned in the comics, but Johnny Storm perpetually smells like a fart. Then, they have the ability to “blow” the flame away from the body with a limited telekinesis of the combusting air. Basically, they mentally generate wind to blow the fire away from the body.

Now how about (the original) Pyro? I propose Pyro is just that last bit. I propose Pyro does not have the telekinetic ability to agitate individual molecules to create heat energy and ignite combustion, like Mary or Legion. Nor does he emit a combustible gas and generate heat with his body, like Torch or Rusty.

Instead, Pyro is actually an talented aerokinetic. He is able to exercise fine control over the movements of air that allows him to create the elaborate fire shapes that he’s been shown to do. Pyro in fact could do much more than play with fire, but he doesn’t really know how his powers work. He discovered them when playing with fire, and never thought to try to do anything else with them.

[ultimatekey]

Has anyone ever read the book Firestarter by Stephen King?

Now that I think about it, it is possible that Legion and Typhoid Mary's abilities were inspired by the main characters' powers from that book.

[grief]

Sunfire generates the fire from his body, while Mary and Legion can start a fire anywhere with their mind.

Just to be difficult, I’d like to point out that Sunfire’s powers are, classically, the creation of solar atomic radiation, not specifically fire generation and control. Much like Firestar, the more technical aspects of his powers get glossed over for the ease of storytelling.

[Gibbering Fool]

Sunfire generates the fire from his body, while Mary and Legion can start a fire anywhere with their mind.

Just to be difficult, I’d like to point out that Sunfire’s powers are, classically, the creation of solar atomic radiation, not specifically fire generation and control. Much like Firestar, the more technical aspects of his powers get glossed over for the ease of storytelling.

True, he absorbs solar radiation and converts it into ionised plasma/solar radiation which then ignites the atmosphere around him. So he does create fire indirectly but there's a step in between